“IQ” and other intelligence tests are incredibly flawed. The biggest issue is that intelligence is very hard to define. Not to mention the IQ test comes from racist origins and was used for immigration testing for a long time.
I imagine it’s because the attributes that IQ measure could be the same as we use to measure success.
Effectively if your test is based on the skills needed for STEM, and the STEM fields have jobs with high pay and respect, then you’re likely to be considered “successful”. But the same person could be awful at communication, politics, the arts, and just be ignorant at large to how the world works. They may even be hyper specialized to their field but lack the flexibility in their intelligence to understand other STEM fields (I hear physicists are guilty of this).
Another, simpler answer, could just be that already wealthy people have better access to stable education, so they were already successful in many ways.
Just to continue to throw wrenches into the preconceptions, let’s not forget that a huge part of what we consider success in the modern world can be attributed to emotional intelligence as much as spatial awareness and logic.
A lot of CEO’s and people who climb high in the world are excellent at understanding how others feel and using emotion to communicate, share and inspire people to follow. Sometimes it’s the only thing leadership figureheads even know how to do. It’s also very, very hard to manage teams effectively if you don’t have a good understanding of how people feel at different times, how best to address those feelings and an idea how to manage the emotional atmosphere in a workplace. Yes, having good logic and reasoning is massively important, but rarely alone.
We know this, the issue is until a more comprehensive test comes around, the IQ test is the best we have, also measuring general pattern recognition can be pretty useful as a “quick and sweet” measure since pattern recognition is the base for all other forms of intelligence
Why do we even need such a test? It seems like you shouldn’t place people into arbitrary categories. Intelligence can’t really be defined. A test that looks for intelligence is always going to be biased and discriminatory.
It reminds me of social scoring and even of ethnic cleansing in the worse case. People shouldn’t have there lives defined by a test.
I can see where your coming from but i have to say, intelligence is definitely not arbitrary, it’s just very wide and can be difficult to define exactly. Kind of like consciousness, we know it exists but we can’t really place a finger on it
Some people are 100% stupider than others and some are definitely smarter than others. I’m sure we can all agree Einstein is smarter than a hair stylist, and while yes thats an extreme example, it’s necessary to get the idea across
The real issue of measuring intelligence (in my opinion) is that there’s so many different types of intelligence which is why the IQ test is flawed, it boils down hundreds of different spaces into a single number
This is stupid. Noting that there is a bell curve of some innate talent we label intelligence is like noting there’s a bell curve on a person’s height.
My point was what makes a person intelligent? Einstein is a particularly interesting example as he failed school. He also had a very bad sense of style and to my knowledge was not good at cutting hair. In that respect, a good hair dresser is far superior. They are way better at being a hair dresser than Einstein.
We all have talents. It just is a matter of finding what we love. Also it helps to we willing to learn as you can be as smart as can be but still be lazy.
A man who single handedly created: Brownian movement, which helped prove the existence of atoms and molecules. Thequantum theory of light, which explained how light can be both particles and waves. Thespecial theory of relativity. Which explains that time and motion are relative to the observer. The link between mass and energy E = mc2, which also forms much of the basis for nuclear energy
This man basically discovered and explained the universe’s workings before we even had the technology to prove him right
… vs a person who makes hair look pretty
I have to ask. What makes you think we’re all the same intelligence?
Because if we did consider everyone the same, it would take away credit and undermine the people who discovered all these amazing accomplishments. It’s the same reason we don’t view Olympic athletes the same as college athletes, they simply aren’t the same. Removing people’s uniqueness doesn’t create equality, it just creates a depressing dystopia where everything is the sameness, nothing has character, and nothing is unique. Kind of like the beginning of Fahrenheit 451 where everything is black and white because God forbid someone has a different favorite color
Instead we should be celebrating the fact that there are people like Einstein and inspire to be like them, and work towards that level of intelligence. Not pull them down because we aren’t on their level
“IQ” and other intelligence tests are incredibly flawed. The biggest issue is that intelligence is very hard to define. Not to mention the IQ test comes from racist origins and was used for immigration testing for a long time.
Why then does IQ predict success?
I imagine it’s because the attributes that IQ measure could be the same as we use to measure success.
Effectively if your test is based on the skills needed for STEM, and the STEM fields have jobs with high pay and respect, then you’re likely to be considered “successful”. But the same person could be awful at communication, politics, the arts, and just be ignorant at large to how the world works. They may even be hyper specialized to their field but lack the flexibility in their intelligence to understand other STEM fields (I hear physicists are guilty of this).
Another, simpler answer, could just be that already wealthy people have better access to stable education, so they were already successful in many ways.
Just to continue to throw wrenches into the preconceptions, let’s not forget that a huge part of what we consider success in the modern world can be attributed to emotional intelligence as much as spatial awareness and logic.
A lot of CEO’s and people who climb high in the world are excellent at understanding how others feel and using emotion to communicate, share and inspire people to follow. Sometimes it’s the only thing leadership figureheads even know how to do. It’s also very, very hard to manage teams effectively if you don’t have a good understanding of how people feel at different times, how best to address those feelings and an idea how to manage the emotional atmosphere in a workplace. Yes, having good logic and reasoning is massively important, but rarely alone.
Yep, I’m starting to see how useful studying psychology would have been.
I’m 15 years into a tech career and it’s becoming increasingly obvious that the hard problems are not usually tech problems…
It’s not psychology, it’s attentiveness.
We know this, the issue is until a more comprehensive test comes around, the IQ test is the best we have, also measuring general pattern recognition can be pretty useful as a “quick and sweet” measure since pattern recognition is the base for all other forms of intelligence
Why do we even need such a test? It seems like you shouldn’t place people into arbitrary categories. Intelligence can’t really be defined. A test that looks for intelligence is always going to be biased and discriminatory.
It reminds me of social scoring and even of ethnic cleansing in the worse case. People shouldn’t have there lives defined by a test.
I can see where your coming from but i have to say, intelligence is definitely not arbitrary, it’s just very wide and can be difficult to define exactly. Kind of like consciousness, we know it exists but we can’t really place a finger on it
Some people are 100% stupider than others and some are definitely smarter than others. I’m sure we can all agree Einstein is smarter than a hair stylist, and while yes thats an extreme example, it’s necessary to get the idea across
The real issue of measuring intelligence (in my opinion) is that there’s so many different types of intelligence which is why the IQ test is flawed, it boils down hundreds of different spaces into a single number
I actually disagree with that. Why would Einstein be smarter than a hair stylus?
This is stupid. Noting that there is a bell curve of some innate talent we label intelligence is like noting there’s a bell curve on a person’s height.
My point was what makes a person intelligent? Einstein is a particularly interesting example as he failed school. He also had a very bad sense of style and to my knowledge was not good at cutting hair. In that respect, a good hair dresser is far superior. They are way better at being a hair dresser than Einstein.
We all have talents. It just is a matter of finding what we love. Also it helps to we willing to learn as you can be as smart as can be but still be lazy.
The reason for testing is that people on either end of the bell curve need to be educated differently to the people in the middle and to each other
A man who single handedly created: Brownian movement, which helped prove the existence of atoms and molecules. Thequantum theory of light, which explained how light can be both particles and waves. Thespecial theory of relativity. Which explains that time and motion are relative to the observer. The link between mass and energy E = mc2, which also forms much of the basis for nuclear energy
This man basically discovered and explained the universe’s workings before we even had the technology to prove him right
… vs a person who makes hair look pretty
I have to ask. What makes you think we’re all the same intelligence?
Because if we did consider everyone the same, it would take away credit and undermine the people who discovered all these amazing accomplishments. It’s the same reason we don’t view Olympic athletes the same as college athletes, they simply aren’t the same. Removing people’s uniqueness doesn’t create equality, it just creates a depressing dystopia where everything is the sameness, nothing has character, and nothing is unique. Kind of like the beginning of Fahrenheit 451 where everything is black and white because God forbid someone has a different favorite color
Instead we should be celebrating the fact that there are people like Einstein and inspire to be like them, and work towards that level of intelligence. Not pull them down because we aren’t on their level