edit: OK, I think this blog post that /u/NebLem linked decides it. Hard line at “not a rooming house” but I don’t want you to sleep outside tonight.
ORIGINAL:
I remember when I was a kid and on hard times I was taken in by a friend and his dad. It saved me from being on the streets. This sort of situation seems to be developing now that I’m middle aged and my young adult children have friends with less than stable home lives. All these kids are LGBTQ or adjacent, some have diagnosed mental illness.
I want to help, but man… what happens if it goes sideways? I would hate to throw someone out if personal problems got too much. We have the space and these kids are over here all the time anyway, they just don’t have a room and don’t pay anything. Made some pretty kickass food last night though. Money is starting to get pretty tight what with food prices increasing, my insurance just went up, yadda yadda. I was thinking something like $500/mo since I’m already paying for everything, this money would of course help. Seems like two, maybe three kids need shelter.
To be clear, it isn’t imminent but probably by October. So let’s see what Lemmy thinks I should do:
1: No, we will not run a rooming house.
2: Yes, but. You don’t have to pay money and are still a house guest. Please continue to pick up after yourself and buy food when you can.
3: Yes, I will create a few private areas in my basement and you pay me rent. We will be roommates but it’s still my and my wife’s house.
edit: looks like I would definitely need a formal lease as soon as someone brings a suitcase in for more than a night.
Colorado: Guests become tenants after staying for over 14 days within six months
sounds like I already have a couple tenants.
if they are renting and not free-loading, shouldnt be a problem, or you concerned about privacy.
Not sure how it is over there but in The Netherlands in a situation like that it would be difficult to have them leave because you are not allowed to just kick them out without a very good reason (to protect the tenants). So if there are any problems or you changed your mind (at least here) you’d be stuck with them if they refused to leave.
Or maybe realize that we are in the middle of a housing crisis and help your kids that will never have the quality of life that was handed to you?
I think it’s great that you’re willing to offer help to those in need. $500/mo is enough to really help you out with expenses, but likely cheaper than they’re able to find elsewhere. Especially considering that the environment is supportive and safe for them.
That being said, I would strongly recommend getting them to sign well-defined contracts that you get from a real-estate lawyer to help shield you in the case of it turning sour.
My coworker just got finished with a year-long legal battle trying to kick out someone that he allowed to bunk in a spare room for a few months (completely free). Despite them not paying room or board they were classified as tenants and therefore had legal protection that they took every advantage of and made my co-worker’s life hell. I’m all for strong tenant protections, but there’s always going to be the exceptions that abuse the system. I would follow your heart on the payment side, but insist on contracts to protect your livelihood. Don’t let a good deed ruin you.
Imo, landlord-tenant law should really differentiate between small landlords (like OP is considering being) and corporate landlords. Small landlords, who may often have a personal connection with their tenants, are typically the people most open to housing people who are square pegs, unable to fit into corporate housing’s round hole. But they see horror stories like this and decide it isn’t worth the risk. It seems like common sense to me that someone who owns a home and rents out a room to a friend of a friend who has fallen on hard times should be able to kick that person out if they turn out to be a giant dick.
We have a saying that translates roughly to: friendship ends at the money.
So: Don’t.
Give them for free as much as possible. Make your money from other sources.
I feel this but considering the economic situation, if I was the house guest, I would want to contribute to the house. So maybe not foe the OP to ask for money, but I hope the kids are able to contribute some because times is hard. I wouldn’t turn down money if it was offered.
That saying is cool ! What is the original version ? Here, one of the main saying is “good accounting makes good friends”, and i clearly prefer yours.
What is the original version ?
Beim Geld hört die Freundschaft auf (German)
Also got here the “friends, friends, business is discussed separately”
That’s French, right? My best friend is French and boy is he weird about munny.
Yep, French, it reads ‘Les bons comptes font les bons amis’.
It is indeed ! Do you mean weird in the sense “very picky about what you owe to each other” ? Cuz i mainly see either this, either “i will do anything possible to pay for my friend”
The former. At the same time he’ll try to haggle on extremely inexpensive things, then drop $800 on an analog wristwatch. We both make very good money. I’ve spent most of my life broke, so I enjoy my newfound wealth by paying for everything half the time and letting others pay for things half the time when with friends of similar means, not bothering to track dollar amounts, since I’m no longer a missed paycheck away from sleeping under a desk - and will always offer to pay for my broke friends.
My mom took in one of my sister’s friends she was fine. When I left for undergrad my mom took in an additional one my sister’s friends and it was a total disaster.
Those kids had fucked up home lives, in the first case it was the parents issues in the second case the kid was the issue and was just a really bad situation.
I wouldn’t do it.
Where do you live? That determines the legal environment.
You have good intentions, but you should have an exit plan. What will you do if you must ask someone to leave?
Colorado. Very friendly to landlords
Colorado is very friendly to tenants, not landlords.
Not as friendly as California
See, that’s why I’m leaning towards just letting them keep their stuff in the kid’s car and being a houseguest if it came down to it. WHAT would I do if someone has to go? As a house guest I can just say, “Whelp. You should head out.”
IANAL but many localities have provisions that guests become defacto tenants after certain timeframes. This CO lawyer’s blog I found searching for your state’s tenancy laws might be a good read. https://www.colorado-violent-assault-crimes-criminal-lawyer.com/colorado-criminal-law-rights-of-a-house-guest-vs-colorado-trespass-laws
cool, thanks. I found one (possibly slop) article that claims guests in CO become tenants by staying 14 days within 6 months.
edit: wow, thanks. That blog really firmed up my resolve that they will not pay rent. Sounds like it can get very sticky very quickly.
I’d start by looking into local laws regarding landlord/tenant stuff if you haven’t already. Make sure you know what you’re getting yourself into in case things go poorly.
Yes, I would never do this in Belgium. Because if the person has no (other) legal address, it’s impossible to remove them from your home. Even if you have video proof of them regularly shitting in your cornflakes as you’re eating.
There are ways in which this could go very well (i.e. your own example) and ways in which this could go very poorly. So it’s not an easy decision to make.
You don’t mention your wife’s opinion on this - what does she think? You should only take on renters if both of you are completely on the same page, otherwise this could cause a major rift in your relationship.
If you do end up thinking more seriously about letting them rent your space, you need to be completely clear about your rules and expectations. Tell them (both your kids and their friends) what will absolutely not be tolerated, and stress that they will be kicked out if they don’t follow your rules. And if you’re concerned about legal consequences, make sure to consult with a real estate lawyer to write up a rental contract and brief you on relevant local rental laws.
what does she think
She is fine with them here and actually floated the idea of charging a little rent.
You could always “charge rent” (low amount) as a way of building up a security deposit you give back to them when they leave and use to give some insurance in case they damage anything during the stay.
I’ve known people who’ve regretted it but I’ve also had the privilege of knowing people who had such a positive experience doing it that they kept doing it.
It’s kind of a housing trolley problem. Once the person has worn out their welcome will you have the ability to put your foot down? Because doing so will feel like you are the one putting them out on the street. Some may even call you an enabler.
I am generally in favor of giving people a chance to do the right thing, but this is one of those classic situations where it almost seems like there is no positive outcome possible. Even if they get back on their feet with your help, at what point can you say “hey sorry, but you are doing so well I’m going to make you go spend three as much on on your own housing.” That’s honestly the best outcome and it’s still kind of a shitty situation you probably won’t feel good about. Worst case scenario, the relationship devolves and the person vandalizes your property and your insurance won’t cover intentional damage.
Don’t do business with family, or friends.
I have issues with Dave Ramsey, but he’s often got solid financial advice. One thing that stuck with me was his oft repeated mantra; Never loan money to family and friends, gift them money. If they pay it back, great! If not, you had no expectation that they would.
#Truth
You seem to be open to all three options, and i wouldn’t choose for you. I can provide some thoughts though.
What the kids wants could make the difference between 2 and 3 : do they want something strictly defined and stable (so more 3) or are they looking for something temporary and prone to change (so more 2) ? Their ability to provide the money can also make the decision for you, but since it’s not discuted i assume they can.
Now, between 1 and the others, your wife opinion may make the decision for you, and talking with the kids to setup boundaries to prevent the situation from getting out of hands can be of some help in case you tend towards 2 or 3. Another idea is to search for other options, even if they don’t use them yet, but that they could use in the case it’s not possible at your house anymore, as others suggested.
I knew a family that tried to do this.
Turns out their mental issues also prevented them from taking care of their space. Probably caused them 50k in property damages.
My mom rented out my childhood home to a couple that was struggling and unable to get credit.
They decided they were going to take the roof off and add a second floor without telling her the plan. She didn’t find out until the local authorities contacted her and told her that she would be fined for not having the permits for that kind of job. The tenants realized that they couldn’t actually do any of what they intended, so they quietly left without telling anyone and the house sat through a PA winter with no roof.
I always support helping people, but it is not without it’s risks.
