CW: internalised transphobia, regret, bitterness, just shitty thoughts Note: I’m enby and use they/them. When I say trans I mean ‘not cis’, not ‘binary trans’.
Tap for spoiler
I’ve accepted that I’m not cis since I was 13. At the time I would’ve said I’m binary trans. I’m not really sure how long I’ve “known”. I do remember before that time, I occasionally read about trans kids socially transitioning, and it always made me irrationally angry and kind of sad. It isn’t hard to image why, now.
I tried coming out to my mom a year later, it sucked.
Fast forward to now. I’m in my 20s, I feel ruined. I haven’t come close to transitioning in any way. I feel utterly disconnected from being a man or a woman. I don’t want to go on HRT because I feel like I have too much to lose. I don’t want to be perceived as trans. If I’m to ever transition, I’d be doing it for myself, and I don’t think I could ever be satisfied.
These days I mainly experience really intense bottom dysphoria. I’m not sure how I would ever go about getting surgery because I haven’t been able to get myself to properly bring it up in therapy in years. They know I’m not cis, it’s in my file, but I never get asked to elaborate and it’s just too hard to talk about anyway. Especially since most therapists ive seen were women. Plus, I don’t know what bottom surgery would be like without HRT. At this point, I wish I could have HRT minus the obvious physical effects.
I don’t like being in trans spaces, or honestly around other trans people at all. It makes me really really dysphoric. It’s lonely. I’m scared that if I attempt to transition, I’ll become my own trans person to be around, making me more dysphoric, not less.
I hate being called transfem. Not only because I’m not “fem”, but because it implies my agab, which is no-one’s fucking business. I’m just nonbinary.
In general I’m also in very male-dominated spaces (read: compsci). Most of the women in my life are trans women. This is strangely enough very invalidating. It just makes me feel like what I do is a result of my birth defect
I feel fucking worthless. I’m not proud to be trans. I just hate being a man. I feel like I’m doing other trans people a disservice by not getting help that I can’t get or afford, just because my self-loathing turns into other-loathing eventually.
There was a time where I experimented with names and pronouns with my friends. The only time it didn’t feel like they were “just pretending” is when all communications were suddenly textual for two years. After that it was right back to every “they” or “she” feeling like a lie to my face. It was worse than being misgendered.
I once made someone cry because I said that if I were born a girl, I wouldn’t have been non-binary. I feel like that sums it up pretty well.
Sorry if these kinds of vents are commonplace. As alluded to in the spoilered section, I am not really active here. Just needed to get some shit off my chest.
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I used to feel similarly to some of what you describe. I went from “I dont care about gender” to “okay I’m nonbinary” to actually being much more on the feminine side of things (they/she).
I think you owe it to yourself to try estrogen. It’s very slow acting, and if you wanted you could try if for a few months and nobody would notice and you could still stop with no permanent results. (side note if you do try: don’t waste your time like I did with dose e because it does nothing if it’s not enough to suppress t)
Also I recommend shaving your whole body, just to see how it feels.
There are a lot of things that you can become numb to, but when you change them it can feel like a weight was lifted. You say you don’t dislike your male features, but why not try changing what you can to see what it’s like, and then making an informed decision?
I think you owe it to yourself to try estrogen
You’re probably right. You kinda made me want to again
(Put the rest in a spoiler bc idk the tone kinda sucks)
Tap for spoiler
I just honestly dont know where to start because where I currently have therapy, they dont prescribe hormones, other places are closed for admission (even for the waitlist) and DIY is just too expensive (id rather eat). And tbh I can barely look into it for an hour until the emotions get too overwhelming.
Plus, I’d have to convince some doctor to let me have raloxifene, and have the courage to ask at all
Before I figured out I’m trans – before I came out of the closet to myself – I had a very uncomfortable feeling around trans women. I couldn’t pinpoint what it was stemming from, although I did get as far as thinking that since, for what I knew, gender was a fully imaginatory social construct, those people were “extremely misguided”. Nowadays I’m of course happy I always kept my mouth fully shut about that.
I could feel some feeling that my trans friends’ transness was some kind of threat to me. Mostly because they were defying what later turned out to be a very strong defence mechanism keeping me an egg.
So yeah, why am I telling you this? It’s just, reading your post, it made me feel as it could have been written by me from some years in the past. And I turned out to be a happy transfem in the end. First time of being not depressed in quarter a century!
So, could I inquire you to pinpoint a little better – or actually: a lot more precisely – what it is that makes you feel dysphoric around trans folks?
And a second question: what is it you might lose by trying out HRT?
Thanks for telling me :)
I get dysphoric around trans people, because they’re a present reminder of the fact that I haven’t put a single step in any direction in terms of gender. A reminder of how I feel unfixable. Of how my testosterone puberty could’ve been prevented. It’s got nothing to do with the person in question. Some days I have the same with cis people, mostly women. A reminder of how different things would’ve been if I’d landed a coinflip the right way up. It makes it hard to go outside tbh.
What I might lose by HRT is a sense of normalcy in my discomfort. I’m not a woman. I’m not sure what feminizing hormones would make me feel. I don’t hate most of my masculine features, I just hate that they make me a “man”. Plus, I’m likely to lose the family I currently still depend on because the housing market is a mess. I’m afraid of losing the social safety that I have now. That said, I hate being treated as a man. What fucks me up the most is that I see trans women get treated as if they’re men1, which defeats the purpose for me, as I despise being seen as a man, not my secondary sex characteristics. My thoughts are a bit scattered but I think you probably understand what I mean
1: this felt really shitty to write, but it does happen and it is a concern of mine
Mtf (temporary) and fem (as goal) are not Your spaces? so? There’s lot other spaces on the spectrum! Honestly, there’s so many versions of enby, I never even tried to learn about them all, it’s crazy. Crazy in awesome way, so everyone can find, or even make own space, to feel, to live comfy with. Either finding the very best one, or throwing away every bad ones is a valid way of searching - You getting closer and closer to, or maybe You building that self. Hope You get lot’s of fun discovering that place, and super comfy spot at the end.
Some ways of being self, hrt affects our minds (emotioooooonnsssss) and/or bodies… Yes, it is not “and”, but sometimes may be “or”. I’m no expert, please don’t base on this! Afaik, T(masculine) hormone is the dominating one, if it is in our body, then E(fem) hormone barely can do anything to our bodies and E effects on our minds are also limited. That’s very shallow knowledge, slightly rumoured, but with some support, maybe there is a way that could satisfy You?
For the part of feeling bad among others. Being or not being this or that queer is only small part of ourselves. Far not enough to makes us like each other, while there’s 9569345432695 other aspects that may divide us. They are too young/old, they like the thing I don’t, their political view, coffee vs tea on the old town market square… Lil personal, I’ve decided to leave some trans communities of awesome peoples who helped me af, because of their politics that was unacceptable to me, listening and talking about daily. Unsure I should write that… don’t want to be bitching, maybe in a good faith as example? Even here on c/mtf, I often having mixed feelings, I’m jealous of success of so many beautiful peoples in front of me. One day, they gives me energy to do my own run, other day I’m downed that I won’t be alike, ever… Yeah, we are different on so many ways, one or few aspects unite us - being queers, non-cis, followers of Blahaj.
Third side, Your parents, possibly doc, gov office put You under this binary, amab label at start. You already know You’re not that amab. You already did move Your spot on the spectrum, from cis amab to anywhere else, with possibility of more moves in the future. By definition and all best wishes, that’s trans already. Sorry, not sorry. I call thee, do not be afraid of that, of the word. As earlier, that’s just one aspect of us and probably You’re not same, or maybe even similar to others (that would be boring).
Finally. Thank You for picking this trans space, forum, to bring Your topic. For Your trust in us.
<HUGSIES> Beautiful enby.
Internalized transphobia is a bitch, but it does not need to be the end. I am currently in transition, on hrt since january. I used to wish that I was not percived as Trans. My first time seeing Trans people were “crazy SJW” compilation and then the first intecactions later in the 4tran community (were I also kinda cracked my egg).
This left me with a weird way of seeing trans people. I did not want to end up like one of the trans women who got mocked by 4tran. So I hid a lot and only experimented with clothes when I really liked them. I was very afraid of being seen as a man in a dress. In retrospect I was mainly afraid of being seen as a man.
When starting transition I met up more with trans people in local support groups and tbh I generally dislike most of them. If it werent for our shared trans identity I would not have contact with most of them. But still they help me, I help them. Some of them are like the people 4tranners and SJW compilations mocked and talking to them really helped me work through internalized transphobia. Their transnes was never really the source of my dislike. It was rather their behaviour, their smell, their lack of direction in life I could go on and on. At the end of the day I learned that I still have lots of other bad phobias I need to work on…
I think we just tend to fixate more on other trans people a lot. Cause we share something. If I were to look at the average percent of cis people I dislike it would be pretty similar to my percentage with trans people. I generally dislike most ppl
My main motivator of transition was because I hated being a man so much I just had to do it. I am fitting more into the transfem because being openly nb seems even harder to me. In day to day life I mostly get treated like a genderless blob I really enjoy that.
Why do you have too much to loose with hrt. You can go on it for 2-3months see if you like it and most changes will reverse or be not there yet. It also really helped me mentally not seeing my own mind like that of a failed/broken man anymore.
Also I dont know of any bottom surgery that does not remove testes so the you’d have to at least do T :/
I hope my experience can at least help you a bit.
At the end I want to say that even if you arent a woman experiencing feminity and gender can be utterly beautiful. I hope you can find a way to be more at ease with yourself!
It sounds like we share(d) a lot of feelings.
I’ve only been on 4tran once, out of morbid curiosity. It seems like an awful place, but a lot of what was being said was at the very least familiar to me. Not sure where I got it from.
Thank you for writing about your experience. It genuinely meant a lot to read.
I am happy this meant something to you. Usually I do not really talk about these ugly things I had in me. It is kinda shameful to admit but these thougts were part of me still I hold some internalized transphobia sometimes but its a LOT better. I think part of the beauty of transition is not only that you are able to present yourself differently, being more happy with your body and feel like you “fit better” in social groups. But that you are forced to actively engage in your way of thinking, who you want to be, how you want to view the world.
On pronouns I felt pretty similar for some time, but it gets better. For me there was just this disconnect between I am presenting nearly completely male with my clothes and still did a lot of “manly” things. I couldn’t grasp how anyone could ever say “she” and truly believe I was a woman. I couldnt even see myself as a woman lots of times how could anyone else. Nowadays it is a lot better Estrogen really does wonders (though eat a lot and no nicotine!!) my skin is softer, my face more rounded, I finally got them (small) tiddies, over the last year my wardrobe has been improving a lot, I feel like I can style myself authentically now and especially woman seem to be wayyy more comfortable around me as I have slowly but surely picked up on more and more social cues.
All of this happened in a span of 3 years. Becoming yourself is a slow process and you can go at your pace, I know some trans people who realized they were trans and immediately started going with fake boobs skirts and heavy make up, they made it work, but that does not need to be you. Taking small and calculated steps will at some point lead you were you want to be even though it also can be difficult, Sometimes I feel myself not moving forward with transition and it hurts a lot but every step you take forward and feel just a little more yourself is a a step you took and over time and time you will notice that you feel more yourself.
Honestly though you may not like to hear it but HRT made the biggest change in my life, once I got on it and realized I did not want to live a single day with a testosterone dominant body again. I was locked in, but in a good way I had the certainty that what I was doing was right and HRT will make people perceive you as a man wayyy less. I truly enjoy being a woman nowadays also it is a way more pleasant experience than being a man. But truly I just wish for a world with no gender… Even then I’d probably still do HRT.
I want you to know that there is no shame in being trans, there is no shame in being perceived as trans, the shame is on the people thinking any less of you because you are.
I’m not really sure how to reply, but I want you to know I appreciate what you wrote a lot. Thank you
I’m glad there is a place that you can share this and I hope you found some peace in doing so. I hear a lot of conflict in your words. It’s not uncommon for people that aren’t cis to go through these types of things. I hope you can find some relief when you are ready.
Thank you for taking the time to read, and for the kind words
Removed by mod
If I’m nice will you leave my comment up?
If you act bigoted towards trans people, because you’re trans and can’t come out due to internalized bigotry, then other trans people notice and it hurts. You’re being hurtful.
I understand. I wouldn’t say I act bigoted towards trans people, though. I try my best not to, anyway. I go to protests, stand up for and support people around me and am open about being nonbinary.
I understand why you said what you said in your removed comment as well. But what do you expect from me? To get over myself? I’m not trying to hurt the people around me. It’s not like I want to hate myself, or that I don’t recognize that it’s a problem. Working on it alone just hasn’t been enough.
I’m sorry that you felt what you did because you read my post.
I appreciate you listening. I do expect you to be able to be more accepting of other trans people and to be stronger in the face of bigotry.
I think you are able to overcome these feelings.
The thing I probably feel the most about being a trans person is that I feel like I’m constantly being proven right that people secretly hate us. That I should trust my gut instincts when I feel that energy and protect myself accordingly.
Every post lately on every platform has this air right now. Of “how can I fit in more and avoid being outcast” and the answer to that question is meet the needs of the status quo. And the status quo right now is and has been “try to remove trans people from society”.
I don’t think there are answers that work that aren’t “stop being afraid of being trans”
